In the 1980s, it was Yosser Hughes in the bleak BBC drama “Boys from the Blackstuff” whose desperate plea “gizza job” was a catchphrase in the recession on both sides of the Irish Sea. Yesterday, one of Ireland’s most successful developers during the boom/bubble, Sean Dunne, gave an interview to the Irish Independent where he might have conceived a catchphrase for the 2010s as he told journalist Mark Hilliard “NAMA has taken everything off me; I’m in receivership, would you stop! Here give me a loan will ya!”
There’s very little new in the interview itself. The accompanying photograph confirms that Sean Dunne, the man and the developer, has trimmed down in more ways than one – rumour has it that the Missus has him on a diet and pounding the pavement to jog off the years of good living. It is true that NAMA appointed receivers to some of his property in Ireland in July 2011 and there are likely to be problematic legacy personal guarantees to sort out, but Sean Dunne also did business with non-NAMA banks – he said last week whilst commenting on ongoing renovation works at his Ballsbridge D4 Inn “I would like to thank our customers of D4Hotels and our funders Ulster Bank, ACC Bank and Kaupthing Singer Friedlander who have been most supportive of the D4 Hotels” so he’s not finished here by any means.
In recent months, Sean Dunne seems to have kept a low profile in Ireland. He was on the winning side of a legal case against a cleaning company who overcharged him at one of his apartment blocks – the court judgment is detailed in the blogpost “Baron Hardup, Widow Twankey and a feather duster – the Sean Dunne/Gina Farrell pantomime (with Buttons played by NAMA)” – and more importantly in September 2011 he finally secured planning permission to redevelop the Ballsbridge landbank he built up in the 2000s, though it has been said that development won’t begin for at least five years. In the US, he and his wife Gayle have been redeveloping one or two houses in Connecticut – small beer by The Baron of Ballsbridge’s standards. And in a legal case to retrieve a sum of money paid to a US attorney, it emerged that Gayle Dunne (or Gayle Killilea to use her maiden name by which she is sometimes still called) was investing in US property.
In the interview in today’s Independent, Sean Dunne confirms that he and his family have emigrated and indeed it’s not new that developers are departing these shores because of difficulty doing business in Ireland, and the main difficulty is they can’t secure the funds/loans needed to develop property. They act as consultants to those who do have cash, and they act as asset managers, and in a small number of cases they act as civil servant-developer hybrids as they develop their assets under NAMA’s close watch. But unless they can access funds, they will be spancelled in their original roles. So don’t be surprised if you come across the desperate plea “here give me a loan will ya!” for some time yet.
NAMA Wine Lake 
It must be quite hobbling to try and do business in Ireland,some of the higher profile developers are displaying all the symptons of amusia.
Sean must have left his hurley stick at home!
“I told them I wasn’t aware of that and was only coming in for a week to play hurling but they kept saying I would have to go home straight away. They thought I was out looking for work.”
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/antrim-hurler-detained-and-threatened-with-deportation-in-all-star-tour-of-us-2952393.html
Sean Dunne’s request for a loan from any bank in Ireland will fall on deaf ears. We do not forgive or forget. And Sean has too high a profile. He has to emigrate if he wants to make a living. America is open for business, I passed a bank on the highway the other day that had a huge banner hanging “Korky like” on its facade proclaiming “Come in. If you want a loan, the answer’s Yes”
The Bank of Ireland is reputed to be open for property loans at present, but I’m sure that is on a very selective basis and at a suitably low LTV.
NAMA couldn’t get anyone to express an interest in their “staple” finance, although some hardy souls may be patient and desperate enough to say “yes” to them eventually. It takes them 3 to 4 weeks to get a response from them after they receive a form A (if you want a glass of water in their offices, you have to fill one in), and even then it is full of caveats.
They are holding up decisions on business expansion all over the country at present. Some of those businesses are critical socially and economically. No one in their right mind would want any sort of an ongoing business relationship with them.
No, no loans for the Dunner in Ireland. And I don’t know why he would want one either.
Maybe I’m mistaken but I thought that Dunner’s problem is that he has TOO MANY loans in Ireland and can’t/won’t pay them back.
Did you not get the memo ?
That’s your problem now,adios amigos,slainte,arrivederci !
Yea, that’s the problem. Every man, woman and child in this country is shouldering about US$15k of (mainly to date developer) debts which are not being repaid. In addition, there is the opportunity cost arising from the fact that these debts amount to about 50+ percent of GDP (much higher if GNP is used) and have to be financed by borrowings with interest payments amounting a significant proportion of all income tax receipts. Not to mention the looming mortgage problem caused by grossly overpriced houses. Quite some problem!!
Would be interested in hearing what the net per capita cost of the banking crisis is/was.
@Brian, Yes, he has too many loans in Ireland, but as in Kavanagh’s poem they have their genesis in “puddles of the past”. I’m sure if he laid his ego down, and thought about it he would realise that he is branded and that his future lies elsewhere.
@brian; “Every man, woman and child in this country is shouldering about US$15k of (mainly to date developer) debts which are not being repaid.”
Very true, Brian. But IMHO, they are banks debts. Can you give me the single most relevant reason – the core cause – of WHY every man woman and child shoulders these debts. Just one reason.
These “puddles of the past” have turned into a ‘deluge of debt’ for the Irish people. I don’t know if big developers are branded but they certainly have one hell of a credit history.
Just one reason: If something had not been done on that fateful night of the long guarantees, the banks would not have opened the next day (as discussed in earlier thread) with appalling consequences. Of course, the government went too far with its guarantee* and the stupid** bondholder should have taken a mega hit, I’m blo*dy sure that, having taken control of the banks’ debts, these bondholders would have wrung blood from stones in pursuit of borrowers in sharp contrast to the Nama approach of forgive and forget.
* See my letter in the Irish Times dated 30th September 2008:
http://www.planware.org/briansblog/2008/09/guarantees-for-banks.html
** Did none of these bondholders not ask themselves why the Irish banks were consistently achieving the highest ROCEs and ROEs amongst European banks during the early 2000s and question their L/D ratios etc. and loan concentrations.
Oh Brian take it like a man,put your shoulder to the wheel,grab a shovel !!
You may spook the bond holders,break a sweat,top markets according to barrons and WSJ paying all the unsecured DEBTS like a bunch of amadans!
Lets persecute Sean Dunne,pi.. millions away chasing David…
leave it to Elvis !
We’re caught in a trap
I can’t walk out
Because I love you too much baby
Why can’t you see
What you’re doing to me
When you don’t believe a word I say?
We can’t go on together
With suspicious minds
And we can’t build our dreams
On suspicious minds
it’s smoke and mirrors to distract you,invented way back.
Look at the bigger picture,chasing a load of dead beat developers is a game,have fun.
“Gladiators were slaves or prisoners made to fight each other, or wild animals, in front of crowds. These fights were a part of events called “the games”. They took place in huge open-air buildings ….
At the end of a gladiator fight the emperor would often give a “thumbs up” or a “thumbs down” signal. This was to show whether he wanted the loser to live or to die”
http://atschool.eduweb.co.uk/nettsch/time/rgames.html
@Brian they buy “ratings” not the time nor inclination to actually look into the underlying collateral.
Anglo became a “short” it was a way to profit on the collapse of the Irish economy,then double down by buying bonds at 50 % off face,certain investors,pension funds,can only hold high grade paper.
Basically a load of scumbags in NY and London,shorted Anglo with a tsunami of capital.Clearly there were inherent weaknness underlying,but that could have been covered up,and should have been……hold on they fuc… that up too.
The same astute investors then,got to bite on Anglo bonds,which flooded the market caused by ratings downgrades.
I’m not talking about “ratings” and I’m not referring to the St Patrick’s Day massacre of Anglo or shorting,
I’m referring to basic financial ratios derived from the banks’ accounts. Anyone with a modicum of expertise should have seen that the banks were getting funds (in excess of their normal loan/deposit ratio) at, say, 3% from UK, German and other sources and then lending at 5% in huge tranches to developers etc. to blow a huge bubble. This was a no-brainer but nobody(independent directors, regulators, CBI, ECB, DoF, investors, bondholders, borrowers etc.) smelt a rat or, if they did they held their noses and effectively endorsed a sort of ponzi scheme.
@BF
in my mind, the questions you ask were answered by many on this board and by RTE over the last year.
1. Ireland was mugged.
2. Those who gave a warning were ridicued
It really might be that simple.
But…the real knife in the back came from Ireland’s own government. Hazy September night and all…
Ahhhh,a lot of astute investors avoid “Financials” off balance sheet stuff,know unknowns and all that.The AIG triple A rating,Wachovia,Bank of America all garbage these days.Things that go bump in the night,skeletons in closets.Banks financials are self serving,no one can made much sense of them,often times its what’s off balance sheet that bites them in the ass.
Actually,bizarrely Anglo attempted to diversify its loan book via some US exposure,but their vocabulary was limited they just could not say N…..O…
The madness of crowds,heard mentality,there were a few opposing views,but they quickly got scorned and ridiculed,so how’s the soft landing going these days ………..
If Dunne feels confident enough to come back to Dublin without being issued with summons, called in for questioning, or given a debt notice, then it’s perfectly clear that the pressure has officially been taken off all the developers.
All the developers are now off the hook; safe and sound.
I suppose Harrie Crosbey’s interview was indicative, but Dunne’s trip back to Dublin is the definitive proof that no-one is going after these people for anything. The developers have all been bailed out, by Nama etc, and their debts have been transferred to the people of Ireland, and that’s all there is to it.
I should really be surprised, or angry, or outraged, but I just find myself resigned and a bit sad. I used to expect more from Ireland.
The proverbial meat hook,most developers have lost everything,life time of work gone.If they all “knew” and the deal was cut in some smoky room or tent,why did they not sell ?
Buying shares in Anglo,was all part of a cunning devious strategy,a feint to throw the hysterical baying masses off.
David’s physical location is not preventing a “summons” being issued,sure why bother with all that malarkey,lock him throw away the key,a diet of bread and water too.Gulity until proven innocent !
Not sure if it’s an Irish problem,the neighbors had some banking RE fun and frolics too,they just handled it like professionals.
In the interets of full disclosure,personally have a lot of time for Sean Quinn.
I would have “cFd” Anglo to add a to well run Irish group.Syneriges galore.
Hiring these guys as “consultants and asset managers” is a lot like asking Heman Caine what the chances are a 13 year affair might come out of the woodwork during a presidential campaign.
“Basically a load of scumbags in NY and London,shorted Anglo with a tsunami of capital”
according to Drumm it was Quinn’s CDO’s on 27/8% of Anglo shares that instigated the shorting… why? because they could.
Did Quinn think it was a clever way to build up equity without forking out up front? It may have seemed a piece of smart work to use 8 or 9 merchant banks to do this in order to appear that he was only buying, via CDO’s, a relatively small amount, unfortunately when the cat got out of the bag they were all ‘in the game’ instantly. The shares didn’t stand a chance especially when over 25% of them were ‘in the game’.
20:20 is of course wonderful, and regardless of what buying shares tied to CDO actually meant in the cut-throat banking world, it was the decision to ‘get into’ Anglo in such a big way that was the incorrect business decision. It was very unfortunate for the wider Quinn group where real jobs exist, Sean must rue the day he met the guy who introduced him to ‘modern’ financially engineering.
Of course Anglo would have hit the ropes regardless, it’s lending book was ‘biased’ towards property, the Quinn/CDO saga simply compounded.
The maple ten, if the CBoI, DoF, political offices knew about it, was a case of getting out the drill rig when you have reached rock bottom. This action (lending dosh to prop up your own share price) is illegal whatever way you look at it and it remains illegal regardless who ‘approved’ it. This could be the ‘real’ story about Anglo yet (not to mention flogging off the ‘private’ bank over in Austria and giving a loan to the purchaser to fund over 50% of it, I wonder whose A/C details were removed from future prying eyes).